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	<title>Comments on: PZ being PZ</title>
	<atom:link href="http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/</link>
	<description>Athée Canadien</description>
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		<title>By: Corwin</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15450</link>
		<dc:creator>Corwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 19:44:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15450</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;...but I haven’t been impressed by his constant need to attack his ‘opponents’ character.&lt;/i&gt;

Agreed. PZ is a bit like Ezra Levant that way, even though the two of them are so divergent in their actual opinions - they both seem to be incapable of seriously disagreeing with others without denigrating them in the process. It occurred to me as I was reading your comment that this kind of attitude might be self-reinforcing, in that people who conflate disagreement with attack are going to feel attacked in turn when someone expresses disagreement with &lt;i&gt;them&lt;/i&gt;. And then, naturally, they&#039;re going to want to hit back.

There are things I like about PZ, though. He&#039;s a good writer, he has a gift for explaining science (especially evolution and development), and even his more unhinged rants are often eloquent and punchy enough to make amusing reading. Some of PZ&#039;s targets pretty much deserve the wrath of his flamethrower, too, although I wouldn&#039;t put Stedman in that category.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8230;but I haven’t been impressed by his constant need to attack his ‘opponents’ character.</i></p>
<p>Agreed. PZ is a bit like Ezra Levant that way, even though the two of them are so divergent in their actual opinions &#8211; they both seem to be incapable of seriously disagreeing with others without denigrating them in the process. It occurred to me as I was reading your comment that this kind of attitude might be self-reinforcing, in that people who conflate disagreement with attack are going to feel attacked in turn when someone expresses disagreement with <i>them</i>. And then, naturally, they&#8217;re going to want to hit back.</p>
<p>There are things I like about PZ, though. He&#8217;s a good writer, he has a gift for explaining science (especially evolution and development), and even his more unhinged rants are often eloquent and punchy enough to make amusing reading. Some of PZ&#8217;s targets pretty much deserve the wrath of his flamethrower, too, although I wouldn&#8217;t put Stedman in that category.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter E.</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15430</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Oct 2012 05:54:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15430</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank you for the invitation, Veronica. Unfortunately, I won&#039;t be able to attend this year&#039;s conference due to pre-existing obligations. Meeting you would be a blast for I enjoy your contributions here at CA greatly. Maybe next year...if there is a next year.

It&#039;s true that my only exposure to PZ Myers has been through his FTB and a few Youtube videos. I&#039;m willing to concede that they alone may not fully represent the whole PZ story, but I haven&#039;t been impressed by his constant need to attack his &#039;opponents&#039; character. That&#039;s a clear lack of humility I find unattractive. Plus, l so loathe the term &quot;douchebag&quot;. Aways thought it odd coming from a feminist.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for the invitation, Veronica. Unfortunately, I won&#8217;t be able to attend this year&#8217;s conference due to pre-existing obligations. Meeting you would be a blast for I enjoy your contributions here at CA greatly. Maybe next year&#8230;if there is a next year.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s true that my only exposure to PZ Myers has been through his FTB and a few Youtube videos. I&#8217;m willing to concede that they alone may not fully represent the whole PZ story, but I haven&#8217;t been impressed by his constant need to attack his &#8216;opponents&#8217; character. That&#8217;s a clear lack of humility I find unattractive. Plus, l so loathe the term &#8220;douchebag&#8221;. Aways thought it odd coming from a feminist.</p>
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		<title>By: Veronica</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15414</link>
		<dc:creator>Veronica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 17:22:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15414</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Peter E

You say you are not a fan of PZ.  Have you heard him speak have you had the opportunity to meet the person, not the text. Online persona can be deceptive.  Please consider checking out the Canadian Atheist posts on Eschaton or check out http://eschaton2012.ca/

Please consider attending Eschaton; I would like to meet you.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter E</p>
<p>You say you are not a fan of PZ.  Have you heard him speak have you had the opportunity to meet the person, not the text. Online persona can be deceptive.  Please consider checking out the Canadian Atheist posts on Eschaton or check out <a href="http://eschaton2012.ca/" rel="nofollow">http://eschaton2012.ca/</a></p>
<p>Please consider attending Eschaton; I would like to meet you.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter E.</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15410</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 12:30:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15410</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for clearing that up.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for clearing that up.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15407</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 09:21:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15407</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The title was a mirror of the title of PZs post. So, somewhat sarcastic I suppose.

The second paragraph details what I consider a logical inconsistency, a blind spot, if you will, and I make it clear that PZs behaviour in this regards is ongoing.... PZ being PZ. He usually avoids logical inconsistencies, but not in this case.... but this inconsistency IS pure PZ.

So... strawman.

It bothers me greatly when people... non-sequitar.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The title was a mirror of the title of PZs post. So, somewhat sarcastic I suppose.</p>
<p>The second paragraph details what I consider a logical inconsistency, a blind spot, if you will, and I make it clear that PZs behaviour in this regards is ongoing&#8230;. PZ being PZ. He usually avoids logical inconsistencies, but not in this case&#8230;. but this inconsistency IS pure PZ.</p>
<p>So&#8230; strawman.</p>
<p>It bothers me greatly when people&#8230; non-sequitar.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter E.</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15398</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Oct 2012 02:46:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15398</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If you were being sarcastic about PZ Myers&#039; vitriolic style it didn&#039;t come across the intertubes very well. 

If you weren&#039;t being sarcastic, the second paragraph doesn&#039;t match the title.

So, If you don&#039;t think something is possible does that mean it isn&#039;t? Because THAT would be ridiculous.

It bothers me greatly that religion is taught as divine truth. That doesn&#039;t mean I want to slaughter the believers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you were being sarcastic about PZ Myers&#8217; vitriolic style it didn&#8217;t come across the intertubes very well. </p>
<p>If you weren&#8217;t being sarcastic, the second paragraph doesn&#8217;t match the title.</p>
<p>So, If you don&#8217;t think something is possible does that mean it isn&#8217;t? Because THAT would be ridiculous.</p>
<p>It bothers me greatly that religion is taught as divine truth. That doesn&#8217;t mean I want to slaughter the believers.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15390</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 20:20:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15390</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s not about a single definition, because there simply isn&#039;t one, its about &#039;self-identification&#039;. Many women simply do not identify as feminists, for a variety of reasons, and many feminists even attack other women who do identify as feminists as being &#039;anti-feminist&#039;, in the whole &#039;No true Scotsman&#039; sense.

Like I mentioned, in terms of statistics, women are more religious and more pro-life than men. So depending on your definition, one could even claim that men, in terms of numbers, are &#039;more feminist&#039; than women. Of course, a feminist might counter saying this is &#039;because of privilege&#039;, men are more free to choose.... patriarchy..... misogyny...etc..

I don&#039;t think there is a simple answer, identity is complicated, and definitions of feminism are many.

At this point, I generally ask people: Do you think someone like Sarah Palin, is a feminist? She would certainly fit the bill, in some ways, although most of the self-identified feminists I ask.. cringe at the very idea.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s not about a single definition, because there simply isn&#8217;t one, its about &#8216;self-identification&#8217;. Many women simply do not identify as feminists, for a variety of reasons, and many feminists even attack other women who do identify as feminists as being &#8216;anti-feminist&#8217;, in the whole &#8216;No true Scotsman&#8217; sense.</p>
<p>Like I mentioned, in terms of statistics, women are more religious and more pro-life than men. So depending on your definition, one could even claim that men, in terms of numbers, are &#8216;more feminist&#8217; than women. Of course, a feminist might counter saying this is &#8216;because of privilege&#8217;, men are more free to choose&#8230;. patriarchy&#8230;.. misogyny&#8230;etc..</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think there is a simple answer, identity is complicated, and definitions of feminism are many.</p>
<p>At this point, I generally ask people: Do you think someone like Sarah Palin, is a feminist? She would certainly fit the bill, in some ways, although most of the self-identified feminists I ask.. cringe at the very idea.</p>
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		<title>By: Theo Bromine</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15382</link>
		<dc:creator>Theo Bromine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 17:30:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15382</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Joe:  I would be interested to hear your take on the difference between &quot;what women want&quot; and &quot;what feminists want&quot; from the atheist movement.  As Rebecca West said (99 years ago): &quot;I myself have never been able to find out what feminism is; I only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a doormat&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe:  I would be interested to hear your take on the difference between &#8220;what women want&#8221; and &#8220;what feminists want&#8221; from the atheist movement.  As Rebecca West said (99 years ago): &#8220;I myself have never been able to find out what feminism is; I only know that people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a doormat&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15370</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 09:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15370</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think I stated what I thought the inconsistency was... and it had nothing to do with PZ not being &#039;pure&#039;... thus the title of my post.

Is there some particular part of the post that you didn&#039;t understand?

As to Dawkins, he claims to do that. I don&#039;t think that is really possible. It&#039;s similar to Christians who claim to love the sinner but hate the sin. Its more than a little ridiculous.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I stated what I thought the inconsistency was&#8230; and it had nothing to do with PZ not being &#8216;pure&#8217;&#8230; thus the title of my post.</p>
<p>Is there some particular part of the post that you didn&#8217;t understand?</p>
<p>As to Dawkins, he claims to do that. I don&#8217;t think that is really possible. It&#8217;s similar to Christians who claim to love the sinner but hate the sin. Its more than a little ridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter E.</title>
		<link>http://canadianatheist.com/2012/10/23/pz-being-pz/#comment-15365</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Oct 2012 06:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://canadianatheist.com/?p=9261#comment-15365</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This rant from PZ was pure PZ and even though I&#039;m not a fan, my take on the Salon article was similiar. I found Stedman to be unbelievable.  Where did you find the inconsistency? 

Dawkins has always been able to separate the &#039;belief&#039;  from the &#039;believer&#039;. It is only the accommodationists and the religious who are unable to do that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This rant from PZ was pure PZ and even though I&#8217;m not a fan, my take on the Salon article was similiar. I found Stedman to be unbelievable.  Where did you find the inconsistency? </p>
<p>Dawkins has always been able to separate the &#8216;belief&#8217;  from the &#8216;believer&#8217;. It is only the accommodationists and the religious who are unable to do that.</p>
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